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Title: Sports Bar Debate Topic of the Day


Career200 - October 20, 2008 01:27 PM (GMT)
You are the GM of a brand new expansion franchise. You have a sparkling new ballpark in the commercial heart of the city, a sweetheart TV deal, and a fanbase that is starved for baseball and looking for any reason to get behind your new club. The ownership has given you a blank check to sign someone to be the franchise cornerstone and is committed to the city. Under some weird new rule, you are allowed to take any player from any club's major league roster for your new franchise. Who would you take?

szekely - October 20, 2008 03:44 PM (GMT)
Texeira?
Hamilton?
J Rollins?
Mauer?
Pedroia?

Definitely a position player, not a pitcher.

Career200 - October 20, 2008 06:24 PM (GMT)
Yeah as much as I believe pitching is key, I think I'd lean toward a position player.

I think my guy would have to be Chase Utley.

HotTubMan - October 20, 2008 06:26 PM (GMT)
If any of the premier players are from my hometown area I would choose them. If my city was Baltimore I would choose Texiera.

I wouldn't choose Hamilton at all though. He wouldn't make my list for building around.

I might just take Wieters and run with it. It sounds like a plan...

Bark - October 20, 2008 07:00 PM (GMT)
Hanley Ramírez or Albert Pujols

Milto - October 20, 2008 08:20 PM (GMT)
Matt Holliday.

draftermatt - October 21, 2008 11:10 AM (GMT)
If I were the Nats (the closet to what you've described) I'd take Texiera. I'd throw money at him till he signed. That would bring a few disenchanted O's fans to DC to watch Tex since "Angelos was to cheap to sign him" not realizing that signing him would have a detrimental affect.

I'd also go after C.C. Sabathia.

Career200 - October 21, 2008 02:56 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (draftermatt @ Oct 21 2008, 06:10 AM)
If I were the Nats (the closet to what you've described) I'd take Texiera. I'd throw money at him till he signed. That would bring a few disenchanted O's fans to DC to watch Tex since "Angelos was to cheap to sign him" not realizing that signing him would have a detrimental affect.

I'd also go after C.C. Sabathia.

I didn't have the Nats specifically in mind. But you are right, the Nats come pretty close to fitting that hypothetical (with the exception of the sweetheart TV deal).

I agree though, the Nats will spend some silly money this winter. They almost have to. Oddly enough, if they are wise about what they spend their money on I think they have a chance at being pretty good next year. They won't challenge for that tough division they're in, but I think they could make themselves a decent ballclub with a couple right moves.

HotTubMan - October 22, 2008 04:13 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Oct 21 2008, 10:56 AM)
QUOTE (draftermatt @ Oct 21 2008, 06:10 AM)
If I were the Nats (the closet to what you've described) I'd take Texiera. I'd throw money at him till he signed. That would bring a few disenchanted O's fans to DC to watch Tex since "Angelos was to cheap to sign him" not realizing that signing him would have a detrimental affect.

I'd also go after C.C. Sabathia.

I didn't have the Nats specifically in mind. But you are right, the Nats come pretty close to fitting that hypothetical (with the exception of the sweetheart TV deal).

I agree though, the Nats will spend some silly money this winter. They almost have to. Oddly enough, if they are wise about what they spend their money on I think they have a chance at being pretty good next year. They won't challenge for that tough division they're in, but I think they could make themselves a decent ballclub with a couple right moves.

They sure had more than their fair share of injuries this year and not signing Crow was a sour spot.

With getting a lot of injured guys back their team is not as bad as people think they are but if a team ever had to work on chemistry it would be the Nats.

They have a long way to go in that department and firing most of the coaches normally sets you back in the chemistry department.

Do you think Dukes, Pena and Acta go out to dinner?

Career200 - October 22, 2008 10:28 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (HotTubMan @ Oct 21 2008, 11:13 PM)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Oct 21 2008, 10:56 AM)
QUOTE (draftermatt @ Oct 21 2008, 06:10 AM)
If I were the Nats (the closet to what you've described) I'd take Texiera. I'd throw money at him till he signed. That would bring a few disenchanted O's fans to DC to watch Tex since "Angelos was to cheap to sign him" not realizing that signing him would have a detrimental affect.

I'd also go after C.C. Sabathia.

I didn't have the Nats specifically in mind. But you are right, the Nats come pretty close to fitting that hypothetical (with the exception of the sweetheart TV deal).

I agree though, the Nats will spend some silly money this winter. They almost have to. Oddly enough, if they are wise about what they spend their money on I think they have a chance at being pretty good next year. They won't challenge for that tough division they're in, but I think they could make themselves a decent ballclub with a couple right moves.

They sure had more than their fair share of injuries this year and not signing Crow was a sour spot.

With getting a lot of injured guys back their team is not as bad as people think they are but if a team ever had to work on chemistry it would be the Nats.

They have a long way to go in that department and firing most of the coaches normally sets you back in the chemistry department.

Do you think Dukes, Pena and Acta go out to dinner?

There was an article in the Post about how different levels of management weren't getting along. But in the end, the players don't have to go out to dinner, they just have to play baseball. My understanding is that as far as Acta is concerned, his players generally like him.

Truthfully, I don't think firing your coaches hurts the club as much as you seem to think. The big thing to me is that they kept Randy St. Claire, who I believe is one of the very best pitching coaches in the game.

The Nats have a lot of tablesetters in their lineup with speed everywhere. I think Dukes and Milledge both showed some very good things last season. Cristian Guzman won't give you the same kind of production he did last year, but he's obviously back. I like Bonifacio's speed, intelligence, and his glove. Not a great hitter so far, but even he showed signs of doing some things at the plate toward the end of last season. I think they need to give up on the Austin Kearns experiment, but for some reason Bowden is still convinced that he's a player. Adding one big bopper would transform that lineup dramatically. As for pitching, they seem determined to go with their young arms (and they should - those kids are probably ready and they might as well find out now rather than later whether they can win with them). A couple quality starting pitchers is probably on their list too.

HotTubMan - October 22, 2008 09:10 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Oct 22 2008, 06:28 AM)
QUOTE (HotTubMan @ Oct 21 2008, 11:13 PM)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Oct 21 2008, 10:56 AM)
QUOTE (draftermatt @ Oct 21 2008, 06:10 AM)
If I were the Nats (the closet to what you've described) I'd take Texiera. I'd throw money at him till he signed. That would bring a few disenchanted O's fans to DC to watch Tex since "Angelos was to cheap to sign him" not realizing that signing him would have a detrimental affect.

I'd also go after C.C. Sabathia.

I didn't have the Nats specifically in mind. But you are right, the Nats come pretty close to fitting that hypothetical (with the exception of the sweetheart TV deal).

I agree though, the Nats will spend some silly money this winter. They almost have to. Oddly enough, if they are wise about what they spend their money on I think they have a chance at being pretty good next year. They won't challenge for that tough division they're in, but I think they could make themselves a decent ballclub with a couple right moves.

They sure had more than their fair share of injuries this year and not signing Crow was a sour spot.

With getting a lot of injured guys back their team is not as bad as people think they are but if a team ever had to work on chemistry it would be the Nats.

They have a long way to go in that department and firing most of the coaches normally sets you back in the chemistry department.

Do you think Dukes, Pena and Acta go out to dinner?

There was an article in the Post about how different levels of management weren't getting along. But in the end, the players don't have to go out to dinner, they just have to play baseball. My understanding is that as far as Acta is concerned, his players generally like him.

Truthfully, I don't think firing your coaches hurts the club as much as you seem to think. The big thing to me is that they kept Randy St. Claire, who I believe is one of the very best pitching coaches in the game.

The Nats have a lot of tablesetters in their lineup with speed everywhere. I think Dukes and Milledge both showed some very good things last season. Cristian Guzman won't give you the same kind of production he did last year, but he's obviously back. I like Bonifacio's speed, intelligence, and his glove. Not a great hitter so far, but even he showed signs of doing some things at the plate toward the end of last season. I think they need to give up on the Austin Kearns experiment, but for some reason Bowden is still convinced that he's a player. Adding one big bopper would transform that lineup dramatically. As for pitching, they seem determined to go with their young arms (and they should - those kids are probably ready and they might as well find out now rather than later whether they can win with them). A couple quality starting pitchers is probably on their list too.

For the record I think Acta is a good manager and have no problem with him at the helm.

Players don't have to go out to dinner but it seems to me that teams that get along as a family play better together. I'm not necessarily saying it would turn them into pennant winners, but it helps the clubhouse to gel when everyone has each others back.

The Rays are a good example of this in my opinion. We all knew the talent they had and most of us thought they have a dynasty in the making. They arrived two years quicker than I thought they would but I noticed the jump in their step when they all got on board with Maddons' plan and accepted each other as a whole.

Even Price commented that he felt he belonged the day he got here. This says a lot to me.

I also agree with St. Claire as the pitching coach. A well respected man in the game for sure.


I don't think that Millege or Dukes took a step forward. They spent a lot time on Dukes and he flew off the handle at the first sign of controversy. A guy that can't own up probably never will.

Trying to get Dukes, Milledge, and Pena to get along in mean times will probably be an experiment that will fail. I hope not for them and the Nats but I believe it's inevitable.

Getting rid of Felipe Lopez was a good move and is a step in the right direction, but the org has a long way to go. Normally when you fire coaches because of the tension between the players the players are the next ones to go.

I myself don't think Bowden has done a very good job. I'll take MacPhail hands down over Bowden who seems to like the spotlight and quenches for interviews. His job could be on think ice next season.

Just my opinion

Sluggo - October 22, 2008 09:31 PM (GMT)
If you read the Nationals MLB board, a lot of them are beside themselves that they have to put up with another year of Bowden collecting misfits and ex-Reds. If you thought we had complaints about Crowley, you should have read wha they had to say about their hitting coach.

Wily Mo Cement Shoes (stole that from one of their posters, I loved it) has no discipline and no eye at the plate. We'll see what happens when they get a new hitting coach. Dukes and Milledge could both break out next year. Everyone forgives a head case who can hit. We signed Albert-freakin'-Belle for Chrissakes. Nick Johnson should be back next year, but he could very well trip over the foul line in ST and be out for the year. I think we'll be glad we didn't trade for FLop.

HotTubMan - October 23, 2008 04:30 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Oct 22 2008, 05:31 PM)
If you read the Nationals MLB board, a lot of them are beside themselves that they have to put up with another year of Bowden collecting misfits and ex-Reds. If you thought we had complaints about Crowley, you should have read wha they had to say about their hitting coach.

Wily Mo Cement Shoes (stole that from one of their posters, I loved it) has no discipline and no eye at the plate. We'll see what happens when they get a new hitting coach. Dukes and Milledge could both break out next year. Everyone forgives a head case who can hit. We signed Albert-freakin'-Belle for Chrissakes. Nick Johnson should be back next year, but he could very well trip over the foul line in ST and be out for the year. I think we'll be glad we didn't trade for FLop.

I don't read their boards but it sure sounds like fun!

Sluggo - October 23, 2008 11:49 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (HotTubMan @ Oct 22 2008, 11:30 PM)
I don't read their boards but it sure sounds like fun!

In all actuality it can get pretty tedious, because approximately half the threads eventually turn to Baltimore bashing. I swear those guys care more about hating us than supporting their own. I've bitten off about half my tongue so far.

Career200 - October 23, 2008 02:03 PM (GMT)
Well, what I know of chemistry is that it's good when you're winning, not so good when you're losing.

Yeah, I don't think Milledge or Dukes had the dramatic breakthrough years people wanted them to have. But to be honest, I don't think they're going to turn into the gamebreakers people expected. I think that with the addition of a slugger in the middle of their lineup, you will see that Milledge and Dukes turn into some very good offensive players. That would be a huge weight off of Ryan Zimmerman's shoulders too.

Wily Mo is terrible. Kearns is terrible. Felipe Lopez was terrible and I was glad to see the Nats finally unload him.

That kid Joel Hanrahan is the real deal. He can be an elite closer.

Also watch out for Jordan Zimmerman. A lot of scouts and GMs like him as a future stud. A lot of people think the same of Josh Smoker.

On balance, the Nats stockpile of young arms in the system (Detwiler, Balester, McGeary, Smoker, Zimmerman, and Glenn Gibson) compares pretty well to the O's stockpile.

I love the bench the Nats have. They can bring some real professionals in late-game hitting and defensive situations.

Just some random thoughts.

Sluggo - October 23, 2008 02:50 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Oct 23 2008, 09:03 AM)
On balance, the Nats stockpile of young arms in the system (Detwiler, Balester, McGeary, Smoker, Zimmerman, and Glenn Gibson) compares pretty well to the O's stockpile.

I saw this kid Shairon Martis pitch toward the end of the season, and he was pretty impressive. Saul Rivera is a very solid late-innings guy. I'd rather have him than most the guys in our bullpen.

Career200 - October 23, 2008 10:52 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Oct 23 2008, 09:50 AM)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Oct 23 2008, 09:03 AM)
On balance, the Nats stockpile of young arms in the system (Detwiler, Balester, McGeary, Smoker, Zimmerman, and Glenn Gibson) compares pretty well to the O's stockpile.

I saw this kid Shairon Martis pitch toward the end of the season, and he was pretty impressive. Saul Rivera is a very solid late-innings guy. I'd rather have him than most the guys in our bullpen.

Yeah, I'm not sure what to make of Martis. Saw him get some starts toward the end of last season but I didn't watch him closely. My very basic impression is he's another young guy who walks everyone in the park.

Milto - October 23, 2008 11:40 PM (GMT)
Any relation to Roger Martis?

Career200 - October 24, 2008 10:35 AM (GMT)
No, but possibly a distant relation of the crooner, Johnny Martis.

Milto - October 24, 2008 12:11 PM (GMT)
Possibly, IF, he can hit the right pitch, and change the tone of the game. Then again, that may be Dean Martis.
If not, maybe it is "The Beaver" Jerry Martis, he is related to? Gee...not so sure.

Puma170 - October 24, 2008 12:45 PM (GMT)
I certainly hope that the Nats start playing better baseball since I will be doing most of their games next season (assuming all is right with the arrival of a new son to the Puma fold). It makes for a very long night when you know that win or lose you will be watching some bad baseball.

I think Milledge has gotten a bad rap (pardon the pun.) He gets lumped in, because of a few minor discretions, with a true thug like Dukes and I think Bowden put him in that situation and that is unfair.

From everything that I have seen, the O's are closer to putting it together but that may just be wishful thinking.

PUMA



Career200 - October 24, 2008 01:37 PM (GMT)
Maybe if he was a little faster on his feet, he might've been playing football on Sundays like Clinton Martis.

I'm sure as athletes, they both drive shiny new Aston-Martises.

Maybe he'll follow Billy Martis' footsteps and find better success as a manager.

I think today is a good day for a three-Remy Martis lunch.

Milto - October 24, 2008 02:26 PM (GMT)
The Stock-Martis is killing me.

Career200 - October 24, 2008 02:54 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Milto @ Oct 24 2008, 09:26 AM)
The Stock-Martis is killing me.

No joking there. :(

szekely - October 24, 2008 03:59 PM (GMT)
Milt:

I have a friend who is a stock broker. He confided in me that he tried to end his life after all the recent down turn. But when he jumped out of his window. he was only three feet from the garden.

I told him to get over it--Lot's of people are suffering--and he should not think he should be some kind of Martis about it. IT is not worth dying over. . . .

:pullhairout:

Sluggo - October 24, 2008 05:03 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (szekely @ Oct 24 2008, 10:59 AM)
Milt:

I have a friend who is a stock broker. He confided in me that he tried to end his life after all the recent down turn. But when he jumped out of his window. he was only three feet from the garden.

I told him to get over it--Lot's of people are suffering--and he should not think he should be some kind of Martis about it. IT is not worth dying over. . . .

:pullhairout:

That was a long what to go for a Martis joke. Where is Jack when we need him?

Skipjack - October 24, 2008 07:55 PM (GMT)
Who needs Jack? He's just a samartis…

szekely - October 24, 2008 10:47 PM (GMT)
You are the Professor Samaritis on puns. I am still seeking tenure in comparison.

Milto - October 31, 2008 01:44 AM (GMT)
Andrew asserts:
QUOTE
Lot's of people are suffering--and he should not think he should be some kind of Martis about it. IT is not worth dying over. . . .

I agree, I should just take it like a MAndrew. It would be hard to diversify with rigamartis anyway.

szekely - November 1, 2008 11:43 PM (GMT)
He did become a man. He hit bottom, found Jesus, and became a Preying Mantis.




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