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Title: Rule 3J
Description: Our stove might get hot


Bags - November 14, 2008 10:00 AM (GMT)
QUOTE
"I think Major League (Baseball) Rule 3J prevents me from getting too specific, but I think there are some unique opportunities, due to geography or whatever, that you might have to look into," said MacPhail, the team's president of baseball operations. "You have to be realistic about whether it's attainable or not."

Fans hoping that Severna Park native and Mount St. Joseph's graduate Mark Teixeira might be patrolling first base in orange and black in 2009, or those wishing Monkton resident A.J. Burnett might bolster the Orioles' rotation next season, know exactly what MacPhail is saying -- even though he isn't exactly saying it.

Career200 - November 14, 2008 01:19 PM (GMT)
I'm pretty certain the O's will make moves and get this town buzzing about baseball again.

The real question should be: does Angelos have it in him to finish the project?

Based on past history, he does not.

stanhouse - November 14, 2008 01:20 PM (GMT)
What bothers me about signing free agents this offseason is that we can't sign enough of them to put us over the top. If we use free agency to help rebuild our team, then it seems we would still needs another 1-2 years of drafting (impeded by our free agent signings) and more free agent signings to have enough starting pitching and major league fielders to win. Would Burnett and Teixeira want to come here to win in 2011? I'd love to sign Teixeira (not so sure about Burnett) but it seems he is available a year too soon to benefit us.

Career200 - November 14, 2008 01:36 PM (GMT)
I think we have a tendency of seeing things in black or white. Certainly, I admit to doing that all the time.

I think black and white viewpoints, in discussing the philosophy of sports rebuilding, is a terrible mistake. As far as rebuilding, I don't think a successful plan involves going exlcusively with the farm system or exclusively through free agency and trades. Takes both.

MacPhail and his staff should know what they can expect to come up from the farm over the next 2 or 3 years. They know what they have at the major league level. If they know those two things, then they know what this organization needs if it is going to win if not now, then in the near future. That is where free agency comes in.

As far as this Orioles club and drafting goes, I don't think it matters whether they sign free agents this winter or not - either way, this club needs to continue drafting well and will have to build primarily through the farm and the draft. That should not in any way preclude them from dipping into the free agency and trade market to obtain the things that are not in this organization right now (and by now, we all know what those things are by heart).

Last, and maybe most important, I don't believe that signing free agents or trading for veterans this winter means that the O's are building with the realistic expectation of winning this season. Rather, it's obvious that the O's are relying on a lot of their kids to be the core of this club when it wins. While the objective every year is to win, taking a realistic approach the O's should not expect to go in to free agency and address every need that will "put them over the top." Rather, they should use free agency at this point to get them closer to the top.

That being said, whether it be Teixeira, Burnett, Ramirez, or whomever, the Orioles will have to negotiate with them from the standpoint that they want them to sign a long term deal in Baltimore and with the intention that they be part of a core that can challenge annually and in the near future for the championship. They need to get the free agents to buy into the hope that Markakis, Jones, Wieters, Tillman, Guthrie, Arrieta, etc. represent an annual run at the championship in the near future.

stanhouse - November 14, 2008 02:03 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Nov 14 2008, 08:36 AM)
I think black and white viewpoints, in discussing the philosophy of sports rebuilding, is a terrible mistake. As far as rebuilding, I don't think a successful plan involves going exlcusively with the farm system or exclusively through free agency and trades. Takes both.

The Tigers and Mets provide recent examples of combining high-profile free agent signings with talented young players to become important, if ill-fated, teams. Perhaps adding Teixeira, Burnett & Dr. James Andrews this year will give the Orioles a similar boost by offering them even more to build on in subsequent offseasons.

While I fear that it is too early to sign a player like Teixeira, M.T. is a unique opportunity for the Orioles: a terrific switch-hitting, gold-glove fielding, sentimental marketing bombshell available for a limited time only. All that and possibly a millstone around their neck for years to come.

osfan58202233 - November 14, 2008 06:33 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Nov 14 2008, 09:36 AM)
As far as this Orioles club and drafting goes, I don't think it matters whether they sign free agents this winter or not - either way, this club needs to continue drafting well and will have to build primarily through the farm and the draft. That should not in any way preclude them from dipping into the free agency and trade market to obtain the things that are not in this organization right now (and by now, we all know what those things are by heart).

Last, and maybe most important, I don't believe that signing free agents or trading for veterans this winter means that the O's are building with the realistic expectation of winning this season. Rather, it's obvious that the O's are relying on a lot of their kids to be the core of this club when it wins. While the objective every year is to win, taking a realistic approach the O's should not expect to go in to free agency and address every need that will "put them over the top." Rather, they should use free agency at this point to get them closer to the top.

i do think it matters whether they sign free agents this winter or not. particularly because there is such a deeper pool.

because if you play your cards right, you get someone who is a free agent to use for next year and then lose after that, thereby acquiring additional draft picks. this is the game that the Red Sox play so well. if we're smart, we start creating more of a revolving door of incoming and outgoing free agents that do just that for us every year - bringing us something that might fill a hole if needed, but also bringing us a continuous stream of draft picks.

Career200 - November 14, 2008 06:41 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (osfan58202233 @ Nov 14 2008, 01:33 PM)
QUOTE (Career200 @ Nov 14 2008, 09:36 AM)
As far as this Orioles club and drafting goes, I don't think it matters whether they sign free agents this winter or not - either way, this club needs to continue drafting well and will have to build primarily through the farm and the draft.  That should not in any way preclude them from dipping into the free agency and trade market to obtain the things that are not in this organization right now (and by now, we all know what those things are by heart).

Last, and maybe most important, I don't believe that signing free agents or trading for veterans this winter means that the O's are building with the realistic expectation of winning this season.  Rather, it's obvious that the O's are relying on a lot of their kids to be the core of this club when it wins.  While the objective every year is to win, taking a realistic approach the O's should not expect to go in to free agency and address every need that will "put them over the top."  Rather, they should use free agency at this point to get them closer to the top.

i do think it matters whether they sign free agents this winter or not. particularly because there is such a deeper pool.

because if you play your cards right, you get someone who is a free agent to use for next year and then lose after that, thereby acquiring additional draft picks. this is the game that the Red Sox play so well. if we're smart, we start creating more of a revolving door of incoming and outgoing free agents that do just that for us every year - bringing us something that might fill a hole if needed, but also bringing us a continuous stream of draft picks.

I think I have the same opinion as Stanhouse as far as this goes.

Although the O's don't need to dip into free agency this winter (it's not as though they are a freee agent or two away from winning it all), I believe they should simply because they have some very unique options on the market that aren't usually there. I think the O's would be stupid not to make their best effort to sign Teixeira.

Obviously, I don't see free agency as a means of building a club or of accumulating draft picks. In general, I see free agency strictly as a way to address individual identified needs. It's just that this offseason is very unique.

HotTubMan - November 14, 2008 08:53 PM (GMT)
The cost of getting Texiera is minimal since they will only lose a 2nd round pick. Us giving the Angels a supplemental pick on top of that is so worth it.

The O's have the money in the bank and his age and the fact he is a proven player during the regular and offseason make this a no brainer.

I don't think we should play to heavy in the market, but since our pick is locked in at number 5, its a given this year to sign a type A player.

MacPhail has said he believes in grooming pitching and going after the big bat through free agency. This is his chance.

As for other free agents, I would just take a shot at Garland if he's even an option to play here. Other than that just address the shortstop position through a trade or whatever avenue we go.

The team is going to be built on the promise of the young pitching and it won't be ready by next year, though much improved especially in the bullpen.'

We are inching closer and I believe slow proper steps is the way to build.

Milto - November 14, 2008 11:57 PM (GMT)
Never going to be ready to contend next year if you don't do things to get you ready this year. Doesn't matter what year it is.
I don't believe you can build a winner solely through free agency, or by nourishing the farm system alone, although the latter should never stop. Not availing themselves to the use of all tools is senseless.

You wait for the right free-agent, not the right time.
Yes sign Tex.


osfan58202233 - November 18, 2008 12:23 AM (GMT)
well.

doncha know, the Red Sox are trying to dump Mike Lowell in order to pick up Teixeira and move Youkilis to third.

nobody ever said anything about only signing free agents for draft picks.

on the other hand, here we go again with the Red Sox keeping the FA flow going, getting rid of Bs and picking up As and acquiring draft picks in the process.

if we can't get to the point where we're able to do that at some point, my admittedly greenhorn opinion is that we'll always be far back in Boston's shadow...

Milto - November 18, 2008 01:06 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (osfan58202233 @ Nov 17 2008, 08:23 PM)



nobody ever said anything about only signing free agents for draft picks.

No? Just a thousand reasons why we shouldn't or can't every time it is mentioned.

Sluggo - November 18, 2008 02:12 AM (GMT)
Pick up Lowell on the cheap and throw him on first base if we don't get Texeira, flip him if we do. What the hell.

Sluggo - November 18, 2008 10:33 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Nov 17 2008, 09:12 PM)
Pick up Lowell on the cheap and throw him on first base if we don't get Texeira, flip him if we do. What the hell.

Come on, nobody's gonna rip me for this?

Bags - November 18, 2008 10:59 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Nov 18 2008, 05:33 PM)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Nov 17 2008, 09:12 PM)
Pick up Lowell on the cheap and throw him on first base if we don't get Texeira, flip him if we do.  What the hell.

Come on, nobody's gonna rip me for this?

WTF are you thiking? :lol:

Sean Casey anyone?

Skipjack - November 18, 2008 11:36 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Nov 18 2008, 06:33 PM)
QUOTE (Sluggo @ Nov 17 2008, 09:12 PM)
Pick up Lowell on the cheap and throw him on first base if we don't get Texeira, flip him if we do.  What the hell.

Come on, nobody's gonna rip me for this?

Sluggo, we respect you too much to Flip you a potential Bird like Lowell or Teixiera (this Tex guy has way to many vowels in his name…he could easily be Tezera, much more economical in these dire recession-like days)

I'm doing my part and giving up one of my consonants, an "s," so that my last name would be Mesick…therefore like so many others in the stock market I have lost my "s"

Sluggo - November 18, 2008 11:37 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Bags @ Nov 18 2008, 05:59 PM)
Sean Casey anyone?

"We couldn't land Teixeira so we got Sean Casey" feels a little too much like "We couldn't land Carlos Lee so we got Jay Payton."




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